November 1999
Jim & Weyman letter # 2
Thank you Brother Jim for answering the letter I sent which was to go to Shepherds of the Lord. I did not know if there were any Shepherds of the Lord in the assembly. I sent the letter to you two Brethren hoping you would forward the letter. I always thought you two brethren were Evangelist, Pastors, and Teachers. If you consider yourself Brother Jim to be a Shepherd then I guess this letter is to you.
I do thank you for going over the letter as thoroughly as you have. When I read your letter I had mixed emotions.
In your second paragraph you mentioned you believe I had forgotten my marching orders (I think you meant the orders the Lord has given me for my Christian life). No Brother Jim I have not, the orders that the Lord has given me is different then yours. I am not a Preacher. I do believe the Lord has called you to minister to his children.
Therefore my call for service in the Body of Christ is not the same. My place in the Body is to study to show myself approved unto God, a workman that needed not to be ashamed rightly dividing the word of truth, 2 Tim. 2:15. - - -
To walk worthy of the vocation wherewith I am called. With all lowliness and meekness, with long suffering forbearing (all my Christian brothers) one another in love, Endeavoring to keep the unity of the Spirit (the Holy Spirit) in the bond of peace. Eph. 4:1-3.
To always remember that the Word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in His sight; but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of Him with whom we have to do Heb.4:12 & 13.
To let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart be acceptable in Thy sight, O Lord, my strength, and my Redeemer Psa. 19:14.
To remember "Thy word have I hid in my heart, that I might not sin against Thee Psa. 119:11."
You gave me a lot of Box Car words and what I mean is this, a word by itself has a meaning. Sometimes the word by itself is enough to understand the meaning, but not always. One Box Car does not make a train, but more than one do. I spent hours looking up and hooking up your Box Cars; "avoid", "purge out", "have no company with", "don’t eat with", "cut off", "have no fellowship with", "withdraw from", "don’t partake with", "be aware of", "reject", and "be at peace about it", all from the Apostle Paul’s writings. This is what I call a shotgun approach to a situation. I am still picking out of my hide all the buckshot.
In Acts 19:20 & 21 We can read about some of the problems the early Christians were going through. I understand that the books of Romans, I Corinthians, 2 Corinthians, and Galatians were written at this time. Lets read these two verses: But the unbelieving Jews stirred up the Gentiles and made their minds evil affected against the brethren. Long time therefore abode they speaking boldly in the Lord, which gave testimony unto the words of his grace, and granted signs and wonders to be done by their hands. But the multitude of the city was divided and part held to the Jews, and part with the Apostles (Please notice that the Apostles are here, signs and wonders done are still being performed, and the Jews are very active against the believers.) And when there was an assault made both of the Gentiles, and also of the Jews with their rulers, (Please notice the word rulers used here, all the Jews were still under their Jewish rulers) to use them despitefully, and to stone them. They were a ware of it, and fled unto Lystra and Derbe, cities of Lycaonia, and unto the region that lieth round about: and (thank the Lord they didn’t sit on their hands) they preached the gospel.
Here are four Box Cars. This is what I found my Brother in Christ; I Cor.5:9-13 reads I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators; Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world. But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunker, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat. For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? Do not ye judge them that are within? But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person. (What type of brother are we to have no company with? Do any of those Christians that were marked fall into this category?) Please don’t get angry with me because I ask you questions, I was put out of man made churches because I asked to many questions, you can see I haven’t stopped. And they couldn’t take all my questions.
I wish to give this verse; 1 Cor: 6:2 & 3 Do ye know that the saints shall judge the world? And if the world shall be judge by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters? Know ye not that ye shall judge angels? How much more things that pertain to this life?
2 Cor, 10:3-9 For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war after the flesh: (For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds. Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ, and having in a readiness to revenge all disobedience, when your obedience is fulfilled. Do ye look on things after the outward appearance? If any man trust to himself that he is Christ’s, let him of himself think this again, that, that as he is Christ’s, even so are we Christ’s. For though I should boast somewhat more of our authority, which the Lord hath given us for edification, and not for your destruction, I should not be ashamed: That I may not seem as if I would terrify you by letters.
2 Cor, 12:19-21 Again, think ye that we excuse ourselves unto you? WE speak before God in Christ: But we do all things, dearly beloved, for your edifying. For I fear, lest, when I come, I shall not find you such as I would, and that I shall be found unto you such as you would not, lest there be debates, strifes, backbiting, whisperings, swellings, tumults: And lest, when I come again, my God will humble me among you, and I shall bewail many which have sinned already, and have not repented of the uncleanness and fornication and lasciviousness, which they have committed.
Gal. 5:19-26 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulation’s, wrath, strife, sedition’s, heresies, envyings, murders, drunkenness, revelings, and such like: of which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. But the fruit of the (Holy) Spirit is love, joy, peace, long suffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. And they that are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with the affections and lust. If we live in the (Holy) Spirit, let us also walk in the (Holy) Spirit. Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another.
I have another of your Box Cars, Eph. 5:1-16, Be ye therefore followers of God, as dear children; and walk in love, as Christ also hath loved us, and hath given himself for us an offering and a sacrifice to God for a sweet smelling savour. But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, "let it not once be named among you, as becometh saints;" neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks. For this ye know, that no whore monger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children (unbeliever) of disobedience. Be not ye therefore partakers with them. For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of the light; (For the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth;) proving what is acceptable unto the Lord and "have no fellowship with" the unfruitful works of darkness, but "rather reprove them". I would have to ask the question "Who are we not to be partakers with?" "Who are we to reprove?" (Please notice the next verse.) For it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret (I do believe Romans 1:18-32 fits in here, please read about these unbelievers) Verses 11 & 12 do not apply to Christian Brothers and Sisters in Christ, but to the people in this UNGODLY WORLD.) Wherefore he saith, Awake thou that sleepest, and arise form the dead, and Christ shall give thee light. See that ye walk circumspectly, not as fools, but as wise, Redeeming the time, because the days are evil.
Eph.6 10-18. Finally my brother, be strong in the Lord, and in the power of His might. Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil. For we wrestle not against flesh and blood. But against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of darkness of this world, against "spiritual wickedness" (filthiness of the spirit) in high places.
Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all stand. Stand therefore having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness; and your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace; And above all taking the shield of faith wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked. And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God; Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;
Phil.1:9-11 And I pray, that your love may abound yet more and more in knowledge and in all judgment; That you may approve things that are excellent; That ye may be sincere and without offense till the day of Christ; Being filled with the fruits of righteousness, which are by Jesus Christ, unto the glory and praise of God.
Phil. 2:1-11 If there be any consolation in Christ, if any comfort of love, if any fellowship of the Spirit, if any bowels and mercies. Fulfill ye my joy, that ye be like minded, having the same love, being of one accord, of one mind. Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves. Look not every man on his own things, but every man also on the things of others.
Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Who being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: But made Himself of no reputation, and took upon Him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: And being found in fashion as man, He humbled Himself and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross. Wherefore God also hath highly exalted Him, and given Him a name which is above every name: That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth; And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
I found another Box Car. Phil.3:16-21 Nevertheless, whereto we have already attained, let us walk by the same rule, let us mind the same thing. Brethren, be followers together of me, and Mark them which walk so as ye have us for ensample. (For many walk, of whom I have told you often, and now tell you weeping, that they are enemies of Christ: Whose end is destruction, whose God is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things.) For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall change our vile body that it may be fashioned like unto His glorious body, according to the working whereby He is able even to subdue all things unto Himself.
Who are these brothers to be marked? I do believe the above scriptures clearly identify who they are. There is no question in my mind who these brothers are, and they do have to be marked. But I have to ask you as a Brother in Christ, is there not here a Good Marking of them that walk following the ensample set by Paul? We have two markings here, one for good walking and the other for those that are the enemies of the cross of Christ. I ask you as a brother in Christ and I am not trying to pull you down. Can we can not use scripture wrongly?
Both Phil. 3:16-21 and Romans 16:17-20 speak on the same subject. Please compare the verses in both books. In 1 cor.2:13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man’s wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. In Romans 16 we read the following: Now I beseech you brethren MARK THEM which cause DIVISIONS and OFFENCES CONTRARY to THE DOCTRINE (teaching) which ye have LEARNED; and AVOID THEM. For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple. For your obedience is come abroad unto all men. I am glad therefore on your behalf: but yet I would have you wise unto that which is good, and simple concerning evil. And the God of peace shall bruise SATAN (Does this bring anything to your mind?) under your feet shortly. The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you. Amen.
Is it wrong to ask to question! Who were these people that had caused the divisions? Were they not the believing Jews (Acts 15 verse 5: But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and command them to keep the law of Moses) that wanted the believing Gentiles to be circumcised and keep the law of Moses? What divisions (more then one) were caused here? What were the offences (more then one) contrary to what doctrine (teaching) they had learned? In the book of Romans Paul worked with the unbelieving Jews, the unbelieving Gentiles, and the Church which is Christ Body (believers)
Phil. 4:4-9,13 Rejoice in the Lord always: and again I say, Rejoice. Let your moderation be known unto all men. The Lord is at hand. Be careful for nothing; but in every thing by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known unto God. And the peace of God which passeth all understanding shall keep your hearts and minds through Jesus Christ. Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any vertue, think on these things. Those things, which ye have both learned, and received, and heard, and seen in me, do: And the peace of God be with you. I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me.
I found another Box Car. 1 Thes. 5:5-15 Ye are all children of the light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of the darkness. Therefore let us not sleep, as do others: but let us watch and be sober. For they that sleep, sleep in the night: and they that be drunken are drunken in the night. But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation. For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ, who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him. Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do. And we beseech you, brethren to know those that labour among you, and are over you in the Lord, and admonish you; And to esteem them very highly in love for their work’s sake. And be at peace among yourselves. Now we exhort you, brethren, warn them (not mark) that are unruly, comfort the feebleminded, support the weak, be patient toward all men. See that none render evil unto any man; but ever follow that which is good, both among yourselves, and to all men. (Brother Jim these are beautiful verses and I do believe them with all my heart. Our Ministering Brethren in the early days did warn the unruly sharply, they were faithful to these scriptures.)
Another Box Car. 2 Thes. 3:6-16 Now we command you brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition (what tradition is Paul talking about?) which he received of us.( Also how can you apply this verse to every and any disorder, when Paul is talking about just one? What disorder is Paul talking about? And after what tradition did this disorderly person not follow? I do believe these verses can not be taken out of context and stand alone by itself. Also I believe that the tradition that is in question is from Genesis 3:19. (In the sweat of your face you shall eat bread - - -.If a man does not work don’t feed him!)
Now lets see what Paul is talking about.) For yourselves know how ye ought to follow us: for we behaved not ourselves disorderly among you; neither did we eat any man’s bread for nought; but wrought with labour and travail night and day, that we might not be chargeable to any of you: Not because we have not power but to make ourselves an ensample unto you to follow us. For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any man would not work, neither should he eat. For we hear that there are some which walk among you disorderly, working not at all, but are busybodies. (Now let’s see in the next verse what we are told to do with this disorderly brother) Now them that are such we command and exhort by our Lord Jesus Christ, that with quietness they work, and eat their own bread. But ye brethren, be not weary in well doing. And if any man obey not our word by this epistle note that man, and have no company with him, that he might be ashamed. Yet count him not as an enemy, but admonish him as a brother. Now the Lord of peace himself give you peace always by all means. The lord be with you all.
I am very sorry Brother Jim, but this scripture verse can not be used out of context. Are we allowed to take one verse here and another verse there and keep on taking verses from this book of the bible and from that book of the bible until we have a Doctrine (teaching)? If we can do that, we can teach anything we want? Is this rightly dividing the Word of Truth?
1 Tim.1:8-11 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully; Knowing this, that the law is not made for the righteous man, but for the lawless and the disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for the unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for man slayers, For whore mongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for men stealers, for liars, for perjured persons , and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine; According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God which was committed to my trust.
Another Box Car. 1 Tim. 6:1-6 Let as many servants as are under the yoke count their masters worthy of all honour, that the name of God and his doctrine (teaching) be not blasphemed. And they that have believing masters, let them not despise them, because they are brethren; but rather do them service, because they are faithful and beloved, partakers of the benefit. These things teach and exhort. If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the word of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness; He is proud, knowing nothing, but doting about questions and strifes of words, whereof cometh envy, strife, railings, evil surmisings, Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself. But godliness with contentment is great gain. Brother Jim Who and what kind of man are we to withdraw from?
1 Tim. 6:11 & 12 But thou O man of God, flee these things; and follow after righteousness, godliness, faith, lay hold of eternal life, whereunto thou art also called, and hast professed a good profession before many witnesses.
Brother Jim the next verse I am going to give means a lot to me. While I was in a man made church I had great fear in reading God’s word. I did not want God’s word to capture my mind and take it over. So when I would read on and on and hours would fly by, I would catch myself and slam shut my Bible and put it down very quickly. As I was driving home from church service, I had my radio on and this preacher said he always tried to remember one scripture verse a week. He gave 2 Tim 1:7 For God hath given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind. That verse did it for me. I could now read my Bible without fear of loosing my mind.
2 Tim.2:14&15,22-26 Of these things put them in remembrance, charging them before the Lord that they strive not about words to no profit, but to the subverting of the hearers. Study to show thyself approved unto God, a workman that needed not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master’s use, and prepared unto every good work. Flee also youthful lusts: but follow righteousness, faith, charity, peace, with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart. But foolish and unlearned questions avoid, knowing that they do gender strifes. And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient, In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves, if God peradventure will give them repentance to acknowledging of the truth; And that they recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.
Another Box Car. 2 Tim 3:1-5 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, without natural affection, truce breakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, traitors, heady, high minded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God; having the form of godliness, but denying the power there of; from such turn away. For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts, ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
Brother Jim I don’t like to stop here with this verse, please read to the end of the chapter which is verse 17. Who are we to turn away from? Do any of those that were marked fall into these verses?
2 Tim 4:1-5 I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom; Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with long suffering and doctrine. For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but will after their own selves shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned to fables. But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry.
Brother Jim I do believe you are endeavoring to make full proof of your ministry and my prayers do go up for you and Weyman.
Titus 3:1 & 2 Put them in mind to be subject to principalities and powers, to obey magistrates, to be ready to every good work, to speak evil of no man, to be no brawlers, but gentle, shewing all meekness unto all men.
Romans 13:1-7 Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but that of God: the powers that be are ordained of God. Whosoever therefore resisteth the ordinance of God; and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation. For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then be afraid of the power? Do that which is good, and thou shall have praise of the same: For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil. Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake. For the cause pay ye tribute also: for they are God’s ministers, attending continually upon the very thing. Render therefore to all their dues: custom to whom custom; fear to whom fear, honour to whom honour. Owe no man nothing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
Another Box Car. Hebrews 13:5-7 Let your conversation (Christian life) be without covetousness; and be content with such things as ye have: for he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee. So that we may boldly say, The Lord is my helper, and I shall not fear what man shall do unto me. Remember them which have the rule over you, who have spoken unto you the word of God: whose faith follow, considering the end of their conversation (Christian Life.)
Another Box Car. Hebrews 13:17 Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you.
Another Box Car. Hebrews 13:24 Salute all them that have the rule over you, and all the saints. They of Italy salute you.
Please note three times in chapter 13 the saying "Rule Over You"(This is different, the Jews always had someone ruling over them) this was given to the "believing Hebrew Christians". And the words are not always the same: Remember them, Obey them, Salute them. I do believe there was a reason for this change and if you will notice the word them is used, more then one ruler. I do believe Paul set up Elders to be of help to the Hebrew Christians. And remember Paul is saying good-bye in the closing chapter of the book of Hebrews. The book of Hebrews cover many subjects which would sure cause them to do a lot of thinking.
James 1:22-25 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only. Deceiving your own selves. For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he is like unto a man beholding his natural face in a glass: For he beholdeth himself, and goeth his way, and straightway forgetteth what manner of man he was. But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.
James 3:11 & 18 Doth a fountain send forth at the same place sweet water and bitter? Can the fig tree, my brother bear olive berries? Either a vine , figs? So can no fountain both yield salt water and fresh. Who is a wise man and endued with knowledge among you? Let him shew out of a good conversation (Christian Life) his works with meekness of wisdom. But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth. This wisdom descendeth not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish. For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work. But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy. And the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace of them that make peace.
Brother Jim I don’t know if I covered all Box Cars, if I have missed any please let me know, and I will study them. I want to be right with My Lord, you, and all My Brothers and Sisters in the Lord, both marked and unmarked. And please don’t use this shot gun firing on me again. However I did enjoy reading and studying all of Paul’s writings.